Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

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crashfasano
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by crashfasano »

I've had a problem with Tamiya Primer and X Series paints on Resin. The primer is not holding at all and both paint and primer chip off really easy. I'm going to have to wash, rinse, sand and repeat a couple of times to see if that solves my problem. I use painter's tape for masking, and don't remember having a problem with it pulling the paint off. Good Luck
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by steveracer »

Here is what I get. I let the paint sit for a week plus. Used tamiya tape near the color break area and frog tape for the rest. Tape went down then immediately painted the black. Took tape off 5 hours after application this morning.

Note the damage from tape to the turquoise. Not damage where paint chipped/pulled down to the white tamiya primer. So paint didn’t adhere like testors does to the primer. Now I have to repaint the turquoise then the black will show the same requiring repaint of the black, rinse repeat like Dog Day Afternoon. ??!!

I know others have issues with this paint. Hard to believe you all don’t get this tape paint imprint.

Suggestions?
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by steveracer »

584C9BFE-8C98-4B07-8AA7-9348BE98E6A9.jpeg
So for the nose. I used exclusively tamiya tape.

Sprayed TS (no I didn't, I uses X from the little jar with my airbrush)park green acrylic with alcohol not lacquer thinner. Pulled tape immediately - maybe 15 minutes dwell time. Looks good.

I will spray some tamiya gloss clear on this later. How long do u guys think I should wait?

Then decals. Then semigloss clear over decals.
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Last edited by steveracer on Thu Jan 13, 2022 9:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by Sennafan »

I will repeat

If you paint TS paints over various brands of tape including Tamiya, over pre applied TS paints, even after weeks of drying, and leave a good wet coat, and let it dry, more than likely it will react with the paint underneath

My only solution

Only

Is to take the tape off almost immediately

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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by Sennafan »

And I don’t think we should say TS park green acrylic

I don’t think it’s acrylic, it is an acrylic lacquer, if a spray can, and usually needs lacquer thinner??
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by Paul_OFarrell »

Hi Steve,

You've mentioned that the tape leaves an imprint in the turquoise paint. Also there is mention of paint getting pulled off in some areas.

Assuming that the turquoise paint is 100% dry when you applied the tape, it could be an issue with the underlying primer being softened by the lacquer paint.

Which specific primer did you use?

Lacquer paint does not dry in the same manner that conventional enamel paints do. Where enamel paints dry in successive layers, lacquer paints chemically etch into the underlying paint instead. This may cause some temporary softening of the underlying surface to occur, depending on how thick the layer ( or layers ) of paint were. Is it possible that the primer might not have been completely dry when you applied the colour? Assuming the primer was 100% dry, it may have been the build up of colour being applied too quickly which has caused the paint to go soft.

It's always best to apply colour in very light "fogged on" coats and gradually build up the colour. Don't try to completely cover the area with one or two passes of the can. You need to allow enough time between each successive light coat to allow the freshly applied lacquer paint to finish its etching.

This is why it's a good idea to have some test spraying items to hand while you paint. Keep a couple of spare items handy like plastic spoons and use these as your test mules. Spray one spoon first using the same "light coats" method as explained above and watch how the paint lays. Again, don't apply too much paint in one go. The idea is to **gradually** build up the thin paint layers in successive layers and eventually cover the underlying surface. it should take at least 4 or more passes before you can see the colour begin to build up, waiting for sufficient time between each coat. The idea of using test mules is so you can touch the painted spoon to get an idea of when that layer has flashed off and is ready for the next layer. The duration of time needed for flashing off to happen will depend on how heavy the applied colour coat was. A light fogged on coat will take a much shorter period of time to dry off than a heavier coat. You can happily touch the spoon and leave fingerprints etc in the painted surface because it's for testing purposes only and not part of the actual car.

Without getting too far into science, the other matter to consider is ambient humidity. Any moisture in the atmosphere will have an effect on how the freshly applied paint dries, especially in times of high humidity. This is why it says on the can " not recommended for use below 50F or during high humidity ". With that in mind, it may be advisable to wait for the warmer months before attempting to spray. The same situation applies here in Sydney - we have a few months of high humidity and I've had similar issues where freshly applied coats have not worked out well.

Glad to see the nosecone looks like it went well. Practise makes perfect...

Cheers, Paul
Sydney, Oz
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by fastbackfreddie »

Just to add my 2 cents, and to coexist with others excellent suggestions/experience.
I use exclusive Tamiya TS colors over Tamiya primers, using Tamiya and AIZU tapes.
My technique of building is to work on the body parts first test fitting etc, prime them, leave for several weeks, then add base colour.
I then continue with rest of the kit. It could be many, many months later when I revisit the body parts, by which time its well and truely cured.
I then add other colors, always taking masking tape of immediately after spraying.
Never, ever have I had any reactions from the tape.
I used to, but since starting do build this way, all good.
Tip: even if paint appears or feels dry, if it still has a smell to it, then it has not cured. Leave it.
Patience is the key.
Hope this helps a little.

As for your nose cone, leave it dry for as long as possible. The longer the better.

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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by steveracer »

Sennafan wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 7:04 pm And I don’t think we should say TS park green acrylic

I don’t think it’s acrylic, it is an acrylic lacquer, if a spray can, and usually needs lacquer thinner??
I am a real IDIOT here. The PARK GREEN is X paint out of the jar, the water/alcohol based acrylic....

Wish I could get my stuff straight at times...

And YES I pulled the tape as soon as possible, it did not MESS up the turquoise paint on the nose....
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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by steveracer »

Paul, my humidity is about 20% it is winter here...
And the primer is the white primer from Tamiya, it does NOT build at all, just etches the plastic.
Also, please note my ignorance and the paints I used were TS spray for the turquoise, and a lacquer based black for the carbon area on the tub. I used X for the park green mixed with alcohol, and pulled the tape immediately.

Tim, typically I let bodies set for months, however there was NO smell to my TS turquoise so I worked with it, especially with others saying it is good to go quickly. I have other kits to work on, just want to get this one off the bench. How long does the X acrylics take to work with?

At this point, I am going to work with my spoons to test moving forward, and may use the nose to do so as well as worst case I strip it and start over...

Thanks for the tips guys. I do read and understand your experiences, I guess I just got a little ticked this happened again. Mainly gonna get the tape off the body within a lap or two of application.

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Re: Tamiya TS sprays - Fragile?

Post by Sennafan »

I would not mix if I were you, try and get both paints in TS or acrylic, this will help too, note that you cannot use TS paints over an acrylic even of same brand, I wouldn’t even try, you can paint acrylic over the TS

As to an earlier post, yes, TS paints dry outside in, I live in Houston so fight the humidity all year

It’s funny that oriole post on here about low temperatures and not being able to paint, that is when I get most of painting done, between Oct and Feb,

The rest of the year I have to use a lot of damp Rid or an AC unit
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