Halo and Grosjean

[Marc]

i think there were not enough track workers on site. Only one guy who was not very good with a fire extinguisher and a better one from the other side of the track who did the main job of extinguishing. Same thing for Stroll. He had to get out without any help and the car lay upside down for many minutes. Nothing in comparaison with Hulkenberg in Abou Dahbi (???) last year (or 2 years ago?)
Did you notice that F1 did not replay Stroll getting out of the car by himself. He is lucky the car did not caught fire

[ronnie1972]

After all of these years, the standard of marshaling in F1 still seems to vary dramatically from circuit to circuit. At the European, and North Amercian venue's it seems solid & predictable. Less so at circuits in other parts of the world.
Frankly that crash brought back horrific memories of Peter Revson's fatal testing accident at Kyalami in 1974. People on other forums have made comparison's to the Cevert & Koinigg shunts at The Glen. But that crash was terrifying in its similarity to Peter's accident, fortunately with a infinitely happier outcome. No doubt about it, the Halo saved RG's life, it has emphatically vindicated its installation.
If Romain does sign for AJ Foyt's team for Indycar next year as rumored, I genuinely fear for his safety at IMS. No one has ever questioned his speed, or bravery, but his decision making is another matter. He will need to look no further than his Foyt teammate, and countryman, Sebastian Bourdais for counsel regarding what happens when things go wrong at 230 MPH at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway.

[-Felix-]

I think what you all are referring to was when Alonso in the Mclaren was pushed over Leclerc in the Sauber by Hülkenberg in La Source in Spa. His front wheel hit the Halo hard, which caused the suspension of the Mclaren even to break. This might have been Charles head otherwise...

I think on the one hand it was amazing, that he escaped and the safety features we have now. On the other hand I still think Grosjean had a ton of luck, being able to escape the car by himself because frighteningly, the fire was not extinguished in any way by the marshalls which were too far away from the fire and seemingly too untrained/unable to handle an extinguisher correctly. I guess this has become a neglected subject, because burning cars have become a rarity. At least driver life threatening fires. That was a the most shocking thing for me to be honest.

[stubeck]

i recall at least one other accident where the halo was credited with helping. i remember seeing tire marks across a halo but can’t remember who is was.

also, did you notice stroll’s car was sitting on the halo when upside down? i know the roll bar is there but when he went over the curb, which isn’t exactly flat, my feeling is the halo helped there too.

That was in Spa right after the halo came out. There were tire marks on the halo, but it was at the front of the halo no where near where the driver was. Journalists credited it as saving his life, but the FIA later said it didn't have an effect on him not being injured.

Stroll would have been fine without the halo. The airbox acts as a natural protector.

[JamesB]

When I just saw it, I thought it was the most horrifying accident I had seen in 40 years of F1. I ket it sink in for 48h and still think the same.
-Surely, first that comes to mind is that OK, I admit the HALO saved his life.
-Also if the barriers had been minimally decently designed, you would not have needed the HALO to save his life. It's absolutely unbearable that there are barriers like that, specially now that we have ultra heavy big cars with stiletto/wedge shaped noses.
-Adding up to the "money is enough reason to make a GP" is the already mentioned unefficiency of stewards.
-It's amazing how every other factor played correctly, because even with HALO and other safety measures, Romain could have easily died or gotten seriously hurt. There was a HUGE amount of good luck.
-I disagree with the complaints of "Hollywood" coverage, once it was clear that he was OK, I think it's good to highlight the efficiency of the measures... and also the inefficiency of others
-It takes immense guts to race again after watching that. Kudos for all the drivers.
Nope, stu: the HALO does help, specially if the car cockpit area meets something not flat or flat but smaller than the hypotenuse of the triangle defined by rollhoop heigth and tangent over driver's helmet. It's pure maths. If it did not help in Spa is pure chance: a car sliding over other car's nose will easily smash driver's head against the roll hoop. Similarly, a rolled car that falls on a barrier (Tambay/Brundle, I think, '86) can easily blast driver's head.
In last sundays case, well in the position the tub ended, it seems HALO did not help, but just turn the car 90 degrees on its longitudinal axis and there you have it.
I do have concerns that maybe in a case like this one, HALO might make the scape more difficult, it could brake and poke driver's body, and for instance in Massa's case, it could have directed the spring to an even worse (5cm lower) impact point.
But right at this moment, I'd say I am 60/40-% in favour of HALO...

[smirkoff]

The previous accidents that Halo really protected the driver were: in Formula 2 in 2018, in Barcelona, when the rear tyre of Nirei Fukuzumi's car hit Tadasuke Makino's Halo just at the driver's head right side; and last year in Formula 3, when Alexander Peroni's car was ejected at the middle of the Monza's Parabolica.

I think that the problem with drivers leaving the car with the Halo in part is a question of focused training. Something the FIA should be more rigorous about. Drivers are athletes, they should be trained to get out of turned cars very fast if they are conscious, just as Grosjean luckily did. For now the Federation requires only a timed test of leaving the cockpit at the season's start. I think the FIA should do random checks during the season, as they do with the cars' weight.

[stubeck]

Smirkoff, the FIA said when introducing the halo the allowed time to leave the car was now longer. They're now allowed to leave the car within 10 seconds instead of 5. They haven't given an explanation of why this is.

[JamesB]

They haven't given an explanation of why this is.

Because it's harder, no doubt! they'd be in a "difficult" position if they explicitly said that, but sureley that's the thing

[stubeck]

Yep! As I said, I am against halo, primarily because it fells like a middle ground solution because the FIA didn't like using a solution from Red Bull that Indycar is using.

[CK]

FIA has said that the Halo is not the final solution. It was the best solution at the time for implementation. One cannot wait for a perfect solution for safety. The Halo has proved it worth.

I will not be surprise that the solution in Indycar will become the norm in the future. Engineers will always want to fine a better solution than their current one if they are give the opportunity, i.e. time and money.